The Gender and Sexual Minorities Thread II: So Many Wonders

Octavia · Post by **Octavia** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 4:01 pm

The following are the jobs I had before getting a job writing music:

Caddied at a golf course
Operated rides at a Six Flags
Loaded trucks for UPS
Took phone orders at a pizza place
Stocked shelves at Best Buy
Played drums in various bar bands
Executed dealer trades for a car dealership
Was an executive assistant for a lawyer
Was a personal assistant to a film composer[/list:u]

It's not like I just waltzed into being happy with my job. I had years and years of crappy jobs in order to get enough money and work experience so I could pursue my dream job. I guess some people could call me lucky, but I've spent a whole lot of time in the trenches before finally getting to where I want to be.

West Filly · Post by **West Filly** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 4:29 pm

Your success story is something I look up to. I can't decide whether to call my feeling envy or jealousy, but I feel like the days ahead of me are grim compared to yours right now, although I know how the grass does look greener on the other side. Everyone at the top has a great story of how they got there, and everyone at the bottom has their story of why they're not at the top. The only thing that I, at the bottom, want to hear from someone at the top is recognition that not everyone makes it, and to hear that whatever someone does is fine.

I'll mention that I'm defining the top and the bottom as having a satisfying career, and in terms of happiness, not money.

It's good that you're not giving the impression of an easy ride. It still stings to hear that I "should" follow my dreams, as though I have somehow failed to meet my obligations to myself if I don't. It stings because it feels like there's a lot of things outside of my control that are in the way of me getting the career I'd want, and it stings because I know that a lot of people don't make it out of the trenches. But I understand that I'm responsible for what I choose to do, and that I could choose to maximise my chances of the career I want. If I give up for financial reasons, or any other reason, I chose that, and that's okay.

(?) · Post by **Perrydotto** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:06 pm

Seriously, move on from this discussion. This thread is not the place to discuss the economy and careers. I don't want to repeat myself again.

Aramek · Post by **Aramek** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:08 pm

Can we get back to talking about pegging?

Or was that a bit on the icky side too?

CorvusCaw · Post by **CorvusCaw** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:24 pm

Aramek wrote: ↑
Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:08 pm
Can we get back to talking about pegging? Or was that a bit on the icky side too?

That's a hole different topic that was in another thread... what thoughts would you add to it?

Baked Bads · Post by **Baked Bads** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:30 pm

It's hot.

The Fonz · Post by **The Fonz** » Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:39 pm

Aramek wrote: ↑
Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:08 pm
Can we get back to talking about pegging? Or was that a bit on the icky side too?

It's not on the icky side for some people and that's fine, but it makes me incredibly uncomfortable, that's all. (Also, it's technically got nothing to do with sexual or gender minorities in any way.)

Chaos Sonic · Post by **Chaos Sonic** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 6:08 pm

Corpy wrote: ↑
Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:24 pm
That's a hole different topic that was in another thread... what thoughts would you add to it?

Was that on purpose?

CorvusCaw · Post by **CorvusCaw** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 6:18 pm

What? No. You've got me pegged as some kind of jokester, don't you?

(?) · Post by **Venusy** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 6:29 pm

As much as I enjoy sexchat, the GSM thread isn't the right place for it either, especially when it's making someone uncomfortable.

(?) · Post by **Dexanth** (?) » Sun Dec 22, 2013 8:12 pm

Alright, turning back to 2 pages ago :

Russia's anti-gay law is a strategic play by Putin & those beneath him, as it's a way to appease his primary voting bloc in a way that costs him little real capital. Yes, it angers the rest of the world, but Russia has been turning inward of late, and Putin's primary concern has always been himself; if anyone ever doubted it, the whole affair where he had Medvedev take the reins due to Russia's law against a 3-term President, than after Medvedev's single term was up, he went right back into the role of President again.

Putin is, effectively, a Soviet Premiere wearing the trappings of democracy to give off the illusion that he doesn't have full control of the country.

So, really, unless world pressure grows significant enough that cold calculus makes him decide the foreign & domestic costs to the anti-gay law are greater than the domestic benefit it grants him via appeasing his supporters, that law likely is going nowhere until at least 2024, because a single term for Presidency went from 4 -> 6 years in 2012, which, by amazing coincidence, is when Putin took the office back from Medvedev.

BackgroundPony · Post by **BackgroundPony** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:04 am

Venusy wrote: ↑
Sun Dec 22, 2013 6:29 pm
especially when it's making someone uncomfortable.

In that case, you're doing it wrong! :rimshot:

I'm sorry, I'll stop.

So yeah, Russia is totally going to explode when the Olympics come around. I'm just hoping no one gets hurt. But they're really fostering an atmosphere in which something bad is likely to happen, and that sucks. They're kidding themselves if they think that gay people aren't going to be all gay all over the place while they're there. From what I've always heard, the Olympic village where the athletes stay is basically a barely contained 24/7 orgy. Get a bunch of young, extremely fit people together and give them the release of finally completing the event they've been training years for, and then what do you think they're going to do? And yes, horror of horrors, some of them are gay, and they're going to have that evil wrong kind of sex that corrupts children. What's Russia going to do about it? Hopefully keep their eyes, ears, and mouths slammed shut and sit on their damn hands until everyone leaves. If they really do try anything, I'm afraid of what sort of mess we could end up with.

Octavia · Post by **Octavia** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:11 am

It's an enormous international stage, so athletes are going to be making statements and/or demonstrations on how Russia treats gays. There's going to be a microscope on Russia's reactions to said statements as well, so it will be interesting to see how it all unfolds.

CorvusCaw · Post by **CorvusCaw** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:15 am

Octavia wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:11 am
It's an enormous international stage, so athletes are going to be making statements and/or demonstrations on how Russia treats gays. There's going to be a microscope on Russia's reactions to said statements as well, so it will be interesting to see how it all unfolds.

So, will there be a gay equivalent of the Tommie Smith/John Carlos salute on the medial podium?

Octavia · Post by **Octavia** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:30 am

Corpy wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:15 am
So, will there be a gay equivalent of the Tommie Smith/John Carlos salute on the medial podium?

Maybe someone will bring a rainbow flag up with them to the podium:

londonarbuckle · Post by **londonarbuckle** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:14 am

Corpy wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:15 am
So, will there be a gay equivalent of the Tommie Smith/John Carlos salute on the medial podium?

I sincerely want to see this. And I hope it's SUPER gay,

Octavia · Post by **Octavia** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:20 am

londonarbuckle wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:14 am

I sincerely want to see this. And I hope it's SUPER gay,

Is Johnny Weir going to be in these games?

(?) · Post by **Momo** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 10:49 am

By now most of you should be well acquainted with my deep and abiding hatred of the CAMH, formerly the Clarke Institute. Here's another reason to hate them.

http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/201 ... ation.html

I'm less mad that they're purporting pedophilia to be a sexual orientation, as much as I am mad at the fact their 'research' was conducted with phallometry, a pseudoscience developed in the 50s to root out and imprison gays. It is so sketchy that it's been dismissed as quackery by most developed nations, and is so invasive that the Supreme Court of Canada ruled its compulsory use in sentencing recommendations was cruel and unusual. Imagine the Ludovico Technique scene in clockwork orange, but with sensors wrapped around your genitals.

It should also be noted that this "widely respected" institution is the FIRST, LAST and ONLY gatekeeper to sex reassignment surgery in Ontario; ask for photographs of candidates dressed as both sexes as part if the acceptance process; have rejected candidates for reasons such as they didn't like their chosen transition name or how well they "pass" when presenting; believe that all transgenders are stereotypical representations of the opposite sex, so for instance if you don't like vacuuming and baking and taking care of babies, you're definitely not an MtF; and most insultingly of all, will reject you if you aren't heterosexual.

Full Disclosure: No, I'm not bitter because I didn't get accepted or anything. I got in, and got an official diagnosis for gender identity disorder, and got out. It was a half-pleasant, half-completely-degrading experience.

West Filly · Post by **West Filly** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:12 pm

I looked up this James Cantor guy, and his views on what he calls "Shemales" are just

On related news, dad told me today that he is Transphobic. He literally said "I think I'm transphobic" I just have no idea

. I asked him "in what way?". He was then saying how he thought about it and it made him shudder. He said he's scared of trans people in the same way that claustrophobia is a fear of enclosed spaces??? He seemed apologetic in his tone. I shouldn't have responded the way I did. I said "an enclosed space can't feel alienated if you tried to leave it for fear." He just said that he couldn't help but be scared, and that no one would be offended if he kept it to himself. He's having a real hard time with everything right now, and I have no idea what to do, except just to take care of my life and hope that it gets easier for him with time.

He also asked "do you even know what your mum got you for Christmas?" and that silently pissed me off. I told him "I'd rather that be left a surprise", assuming he meant that mum had recognised my gender in some way with her gift. She doesn't get to see the sincere happiness I would have beamed if I were surprised with that now. I now have this anticipation, which may lead to disappointment if I misread what he meant by this, or if mum decides to bottle out at the last minute.

All of this was a little weird, but I do like the fact that my dad is being honest about his feelings. There's not much I can do to help him with that, but it's better this than him gritting his teeth and pretending everything is okay on the inside.

(?) · Post by **Momo** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:21 pm

If he's admitted it, it's likely something he wants to turn around. It takes some people a long, long time to get over their prejudice. It'll happen, eventually.

confuzzler · Post by **confuzzler** » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:32 pm

So today I bit off wayyyy more than I can chew, but it has a good ending. I'll just copypaste something I posted elsewhere.

Background time: I'm a transgender girl (male-to-female) living in Utah. I have a wonderful boyfriend whom I love very very much. I have a friend who is super duper liberal with me and we hang out and do crazy liberal things sometimes. On Friday Utah became the 18th state to legalize same-sex marriage and they've already denied three emergency stays (attempts to make it illegal again).

Every county is supposed to be issuing marriage licenses, but the county I live in is refusing to do so until they hear "further clarification." My friend heard this and we decided to protest. The plan was simple. We walk in, apply for a license, get denied, hold signs saying that that's not right. Please note that my friend also has a boyfriend. We were supposed to get there before the media arrived, and we managed that beautifully.

So, we go to the courthouse, and I run into a couple of friends. One of them is a personal friend, and one is a more distant friend who's also making a documentary about the LDS (mormon) LGBT population and Utah LGBT culture. I love having friends around, so we let them know what was going on, and I told my documentarian friend that I wasn't going to actually marry my friend. So, we get our license form, fill it out (we got two "bride" forms) and go to get denied. It was supposed to be easy. The clerk walks out, lets us know that he won't marry us (for lame reasons of "we have to wait for further clarification") and we ask for official paperwork stating it as such and our forms signed by him showing that we were denied. It was standard stuff that the local pride center was requesting.

While he's signing his beautiful little bigoted signature, I say "hey, wouldn't it throw a wrench into things if I told him I'm still legally male and see what happens?" So he brings out the paperwork, and I tell him this. Already one news station appeared and was following the story. He becomes flustered and said he'd need clarification on that, got my friend's number and said he'd call her. Cool, whatever, that was hilarious and fun. Except the news person and the documentarian make a deal out of how that's discriminatory against a "legally straight couple" and they get a story about it. The documentarian was in the know about all this, but the news lady wasn't. She asked for our info and we gave it, assuming it would be a small bit story.

Well, we're hanging out with my friends after getting denied trying to think of something to do when the 9th circuit appeals judge starts looking at the case again. My friend convinces me that it's a good idea to stick around, hear what she says and try applying again, just to see what happens/laugh more at the poor county clerk who, at this point, is flustered with all the homosexuality in his office. Then she gets an idea of calling her lawyer and seeing if he would be arrested for not granting the license. I start to worry a bit at this point. During the call 2 more news stations come, and they both start interviewing us. They asked us how long we'd been together. I looked at her silently saying "dude we gotta spill the beans" and she says "we've been dating for a year." Oh god. Now they're all asking about it and, not one to screw things up after they've got going, I give my honest opinion of why we were doing that (because it's not right to not grant legal ceremonies to legal people when it's been legalized) but they think I'm talking about why I'm going to marry my friend. My friend whom I've never even dated.

So, we go back into the office to see what the guy says now that the 9th circuit judge says that it's actually a misdemeanor not to grant a license to someone now, regardless of gender, and the media follows us in, and random people are going into the room to be allies to this beautiful little transgender-cisgender lesbian couple, and at this point I'm seriously freaking out and she is too, but she says "we'll just back out at the last second. No one will know. We won't really get married." Then one of the random allies says that she's an ordained minister and will marry us together if they will allow it, and starts making all these "LEGALIZE LOVE" and whatnot signs and leaving them around the room, causing a ruckus. Crap. We're stuck. Luckily, the clerk has decided to continually be a douche and ignore us while we're waiting to speak with him. My documentarian friend knows what's going on, but has informed me not to tell the truth or it will ruin people's stories and the cause or whatever. My friend is like "WE GOTTA GET OUT SOMEHOW" and so we decide to just tell the one reporter in that room that we would just go to a different county's courthouse and get married. I expect that to be the end, but five more reporters are outside and surround us as we leave the room. I tried to hide but the cameras were everywhere. My friend, not one to "ruin the cause" gives some statement about how we're going up to the city but will consider legal action against the county, and I'm just cowering in the background. I run into my first friend I ran into and i'm like "GET ME OUTTA HERE" and she directs us to the stairs where the media won't attack us as much, and we make a beeline to the door, but only after becoming the posterchild for something that was originally just going to be a small peaceful protest.

TL;DR - I almost married my friend on accident.

Luckily, as an update, my friend just got a call from the mayor offering to officiate our wedding, and she came clean to him. He commended us on our thankless gesture and said that Utah county is now offering marriage licenses, thanks in part to our efforts.

West Filly · Post by **West Filly** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:39 pm

Wow, that's awesome

Shavnir · Post by **Shavnir** » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:42 pm

confuzzler wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:32 pm
TL;DR - I almost married my friend on accident.

I think this may be the most adorable post on the forums; and that's saying something.

(?) · Post by **Momo** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:49 pm

I think the tldr line should be that you helped push through marriage licensing in your county.

Also, that story is right out of a sitcom. The queerest sitcom.

BeautifulShy · Post by **BeautifulShy** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:49 pm

I always enjoy reading what you type up in this thread and the previous thread confuzzler. Glad something positive came out of your adventure.

Mr. Big · Post by **Mr. Big** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:30 pm

confuzzler wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:32 pm
So today I bit off wayyyy more than I can chew, but it has a good ending. I'll just copypaste something I posted elsewhere.

Background time: I'm a transgender girl (male-to-female) living in Utah. I have a wonderful boyfriend whom I love very very much. I have a friend who is super duper liberal with me and we hang out and do crazy liberal things sometimes. On Friday Utah became the 18th state to legalize same-sex marriage and they've already denied three emergency stays (attempts to make it illegal again).

Every county is supposed to be issuing marriage licenses, but the county I live in is refusing to do so until they hear "further clarification." My friend heard this and we decided to protest. The plan was simple. We walk in, apply for a license, get denied, hold signs saying that that's not right. Please note that my friend also has a boyfriend. We were supposed to get there before the media arrived, and we managed that beautifully.

So, we go to the courthouse, and I run into a couple of friends. One of them is a personal friend, and one is a more distant friend who's also making a documentary about the LDS (mormon) LGBT population and Utah LGBT culture. I love having friends around, so we let them know what was going on, and I told my documentarian friend that I wasn't going to actually marry my friend. So, we get our license form, fill it out (we got two "bride" forms) and go to get denied. It was supposed to be easy. The clerk walks out, lets us know that he won't marry us (for lame reasons of "we have to wait for further clarification") and we ask for official paperwork stating it as such and our forms signed by him showing that we were denied. It was standard stuff that the local pride center was requesting.

While he's signing his beautiful little bigoted signature, I say "hey, wouldn't it throw a wrench into things if I told him I'm still legally male and see what happens?" So he brings out the paperwork, and I tell him this. Already one news station appeared and was following the story. He becomes flustered and said he'd need clarification on that, got my friend's number and said he'd call her. Cool, whatever, that was hilarious and fun. Except the news person and the documentarian make a deal out of how that's discriminatory against a "legally straight couple" and they get a story about it. The documentarian was in the know about all this, but the news lady wasn't. She asked for our info and we gave it, assuming it would be a small bit story.

Well, we're hanging out with my friends after getting denied trying to think of something to do when the 9th circuit appeals judge starts looking at the case again. My friend convinces me that it's a good idea to stick around, hear what she says and try applying again, just to see what happens/laugh more at the poor county clerk who, at this point, is flustered with all the homosexuality in his office. Then she gets an idea of calling her lawyer and seeing if he would be arrested for not granting the license. I start to worry a bit at this point. During the call 2 more news stations come, and they both start interviewing us. They asked us how long we'd been together. I looked at her silently saying "dude we gotta spill the beans" and she says "we've been dating for a year." Oh god. Now they're all asking about it and, not one to screw things up after they've got going, I give my honest opinion of why we were doing that (because it's not right to not grant legal ceremonies to legal people when it's been legalized) but they think I'm talking about why I'm going to marry my friend. My friend whom I've never even dated.

So, we go back into the office to see what the guy says now that the 9th circuit judge says that it's actually a misdemeanor not to grant a license to someone now, regardless of gender, and the media follows us in, and random people are going into the room to be allies to this beautiful little transgender-cisgender lesbian couple, and at this point I'm seriously freaking out and she is too, but she says "we'll just back out at the last second. No one will know. We won't really get married." Then one of the random allies says that she's an ordained minister and will marry us together if they will allow it, and starts making all these "LEGALIZE LOVE" and whatnot signs and leaving them around the room, causing a ruckus. Crap. We're stuck. Luckily, the clerk has decided to continually be a douche and ignore us while we're waiting to speak with him. My documentarian friend knows what's going on, but has informed me not to tell the truth or it will ruin people's stories and the cause or whatever. My friend is like "WE GOTTA GET OUT SOMEHOW" and so we decide to just tell the one reporter in that room that we would just go to a different county's courthouse and get married. I expect that to be the end, but five more reporters are outside and surround us as we leave the room. I tried to hide but the cameras were everywhere. My friend, not one to "ruin the cause" gives some statement about how we're going up to the city but will consider legal action against the county, and I'm just cowering in the background. I run into my first friend I ran into and i'm like "GET ME OUTTA HERE" and she directs us to the stairs where the media won't attack us as much, and we make a beeline to the door, but only after becoming the posterchild for something that was originally just going to be a small peaceful protest.

TL;DR - I almost married my friend on accident.

Luckily, as an update, my friend just got a call from the mayor offering to officiate our wedding, and she came clean to him. He commended us on our thankless gesture and said that Utah county is now offering marriage licenses, thanks in part to our efforts.

Is it bad that I kinda found this funny? Like, this sounds like a plot of a comedy movie or a sitcom

Still, I'm glad things came out good in the end

Mordja · Post by **Mordja** » Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:36 pm

Holy moly!

(?) · Post by **ixnay** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:36 pm

confuzzler wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:32 pm
TL;DR - I almost married my friend on accident.

That's an awesome story

Looks like Ohio might be one of the next states to join the party sometime in 2014. A federal judge ruled today that their ban on same-sex marriages is unconsitutional, but it was a very narrow ruling that only applies to death certificates in that state. Despite the narrow scope of the ruling, though, "his statements about Ohio’s gay-marriage ban are sweeping, unequivocal and expected to incite further litigation challenging the law."

CorvusCaw · Post by **CorvusCaw** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:46 pm

I guess you'll be on the news tonight, then?

Headless Horse · Post by **Headless Horse** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:48 pm

Holding demonstrations on the tree lawn

(?) · Post by **Venusy** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:54 pm

All these almost marriages are contributing to all the almost divorce statistics! :argh:

Nah, but that's great, confuzzler, and it has to be great to know that you made a difference.

--

IWF, I'm sorry, and I don't know what to add other than sympathy and a hug.

confuzzler · Post by **confuzzler** » Mon Dec 23, 2013 6:25 pm

Corpy wrote: ↑
Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:46 pm
I guess you'll be on the news tonight, then?

Yup. Also, even though the mayor said we can get married and offered to officiate, that dang county clerk is still refusing to sign the papers and let people get married! If it wasn't for the media storm that would ensue I would march right up there and bonk him on the noggin.

(?) · Post by **Dexanth** (?) » Mon Dec 23, 2013 10:34 pm

Ohmigosh, that is absolutely a real-life sitcom plot. Congratulations, Confuzzler, that is an amazing story.

(?) · Post by **Dexanth** (?) » Tue Dec 24, 2013 2:41 am

This has been a long, long time in coming

(?) · Post by **Momo** (?) » Tue Dec 24, 2013 9:30 am

You'll get no applause from me. Although the ministers opposing this pardon are absolutely disgusting human beings, this pardon is decades too late in coming to come off as anything but reluctant and insincere, and I disagree with the effort to force it through. It doesn't change the fact that they tortured the man who helped bring the world the computer, and made one of the largest single-person contributions in the war against the Nazis, for having the audacity to be robbed while homosexual. But my big problem with the petition, and the final granting of this pardon is that it is essentially forgiving Turing for being homosexual. From the wording of Grayling's reluctant nonpology, that's all the gesture means, too. The apology a few years back meant a lot more, because at least then Gordon Brown had the balls to admit that Turing did nothing wrong.

BackgroundPony · Post by **BackgroundPony** (?) » Tue Dec 24, 2013 9:57 am

Yeah, my reaction is pretty much the same. "About fuckin' time. What do you want, applause? For finally doing the least possible right thing? Piss off!" Get back to me when they decide to give a full, outright, groveling-in-the-dirt apology and name a holiday after him and put his face on the 10 pound note. Not this half-assed back handed pointless non-apology. He doesn't need their worthless 'pardon', they need to beg a pardon from his angry ghost. :offendash:

(?) · Post by **Momo** (?) » Tue Dec 24, 2013 11:29 am

In less depressing news:
http://www.advocate.com/politics/milita ... -sex-union

Snowfire · Post by **Snowfire** (?) » Tue Dec 24, 2013 12:55 pm

Momar wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 24, 2013 9:30 am
You'll get no applause from me. Although the ministers opposing this pardon are absolutely disgusting human beings, this pardon is decades too late in coming to come off as anything but reluctant and insincere, and I disagree with the effort to force it through. It doesn't change the fact that they tortured the man who helped bring the world the computer, and made one of the largest single-person contributions in the war against the Nazis, for having the audacity to be robbed while homosexual. But my big problem with the petition, and the final granting of this pardon is that it is essentially forgiving Turing for being homosexual. From the wording of Grayling's reluctant nonpology, that's all the gesture means, too. The apology a few years back meant a lot more, because at least then Gordon Brown had the balls to admit that Turing did nothing wrong.

Wait, did they really just say "we forgive him"? As in, "you still did something wrong, but we forgive you"?

Wow. Fuck that, and fuck them.

CorvusCaw · Post by **CorvusCaw** (?) » Tue Dec 24, 2013 2:17 pm

Well, they can't uncastrate or unsuicide him. All they can do is say "whoops, we really shouldn't have done that," which they still aren't doing.

Weird Autumn · Post by **Weird Autumn** (?) » Tue Dec 24, 2013 2:54 pm

Snowfire wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 24, 2013 12:55 pm

Wait, did they really just say "we forgive him"? As in, "you still did something wrong, but we forgive you"?

Wow. Fuck that, and fuck them.

That's really not quite the case, but I'll let you be the judge.

The pardon comes after a change of heart by ministers who had previously insisted that Turing was properly convicted of what at the time was a criminal offence.

A pardon is usually granted only when the person is innocent of the offence and where a request has been made by someone with a vested interest, such as a family member. But Turing's pardon has been issued without either requirement being met.

Announcing the change of heart, the Justice Secretary Chris Grayling said Turing deserved to be "remembered and recognised for his fantastic contribution to the war effort" and not for his later criminal conviction.

"His later life was overshadowed by his conviction for homosexual activity, a sentence we would now consider unjust and discriminatory and which has now been repealed," he said. "A pardon from the Queen is a fitting tribute to an exceptional man."