The quality of MLP: FiM fan fiction - Very poor.

[XX55XX]

I've been reading a ton of fan fiction recently, and I can't help but feel disappointed by the crop of fanfics I have read. Usually, I can always find stories or crossovers I like in other media franchises... But, for some reason, a lot of the fanfics feel a bit off. Most of them are competently written, but they just don't seem to tug me in any way. A lot of the crossover fics are even more silly than you can imagine.

The clopfics are even worse - a lot of it is just blatant cartoon porn. I won't name any specific titles, lest I break any rules by doing so.

I mostly read the stories on FF.net or fimfiction.net, is that why?

At any rate, the only fanfic I have grown fond of is the "Pony Psychology" series. Then there's the Doctor Who crossover fic I read on FF.net. "My Little Hangover" is quite good, too.

You might challenge by saying, "Why don't you write some fan fiction of your own?" I do, but I wouldn't call myself the best writer in the world. I am competent, but stuff will never draw in thousands of views like some other fics do.

Is it me, or is the subject material behind MLP just not up to snuff for fanfics? The universe is so stiff and ill-defined that people have to invent their own police departments, characters, towns, etc, which leaves the fics feeling somewhat flat.

[Herr Generalfabulous]

And thus ends the only foray I shall ever make into the FF forum.

[Contra Calculus]

Why the fuck do you read the porn-fics in the first place?

[XX55XX]

Why the fuck do you read the porn-fics in the first place?

Sometimes, I read it for a laugh, not to be aroused by it. But a lot of it is poorly written, in my opinion.

But I'm not just talking about porn fics - I'm talking about MLP: FiM fanfiction in general. It just sucks. BioWare, Invader Zim, Rugrats, and Harry Potter fanfiction is of such higher quality. I'm thinking it has to do with the subject material of MLP.

[Orange Fluffy Sheep]

You're in a subforum for MLP: FiM fanfic that isn't bad.

Also FiMFiction and Fanfiction.net have no quality filtering so of course you'll mostly low quality jank.

[ShadowwalkerPOSTPOSTPOSTPOSTPOSTPOSTPOSTPOSTPOSTPOST]

The median of art has been lowered since the creation of porn.

[kefkafloyd]

How about not talking about porn? Discuss normal fics, please.

[Contra Calculus]

You're in a subforum for MLP: FiM fanfic that isn't bad.

Also FiMFiction and Fanfiction.net have no quality filtering so of course you'll mostly low quality jank.

Spike's Day Off being the pinnacle of what we've reached in this medium called My Little Pony fanfiction... man no matter how much I say it, it is still weird for me to think that My Little Pony fanfiction exists...

[Herr Generalfabulous]

Spike's Day Off

Spike's Day Off is a masterpiece of the highest order.

[Humorless ClodNo fun. Not ever.]

I won't try and argue that the fic on whole is good or bad, but as someone who has navigated many, many fic communities... this one is unique.

Why?

The demographic for most 'bad' fanfic in my experience (7 years) is primarily young girls. I was one of them once, even! Sure, there are males out there (one of my friends is a male writer for Star Wars and The Legend of Zelda, rather acclaimed, actually), creepers out there, and older writers who are bad. But for the vast teeming majority of fanfics on the front pages of ff.net sections, many times the poor quality is inexperience coupled with enthusiasm and a narrow worldview. In other words, kids who are working in a vacuum and aren't getting sufficient criticism to strive and improve... or don't want to because they've equated criticism as negativity rather than constructive.

But most of the time, the 'entry level' fandoms they populate are things that they're socially 'prepped' to write about. Fans of anime will write about anime. Fans of books will write about those books, etc.

The MLP fanfic explosion is singular in that we have way more males than in most demographics (and yes, there are females writing too. I am one of them.) writing something they've never been 'prepped' to write about. Many are used to a totally different feel, tone, set of themes, and acceptable content focus than what FiM contains. Everything they've ever done up to this point means little in how to approach writing about it. It's so different.

This is probably why there are SO many crossovers with FiM now. Because people still try and write what they know and mesh the two ideas... without the experience of integrating the themes of each into the story, or managing to blend them only by throwing characters vastly OOC. Some really GOOD crossovers exist, but they're a needle in a haystack. And then I won't even get into what people are used to in terms of acceptable romance versus what's respectful to the spirit of the show...

So yeah. Not trying to say EVERYTHING IS TERRIBLE IN OUR FANDOM, but there certainly is sub-par material out there... and I think it's important to try and observe and understand why, where it comes from, and how not to make more.

Because I really want to read good fanfics. Which are not bad fanfics.

[XX55XX]

I think you are onto something, Humorless. Inability to set a proper tone is probably the biggest problem. I'm noticing a lot more "humans in Equestria" and "Halo crossover" fics these days (most of which, regardless of how well written they are in a technical sense, are quite crappy).

And, I must say, I don't get why people love Fallout Equestria so much. Too many OCs for my taste, it's as if it's hardly MLP-related at all, maybe except for name and references to MLP.

[Opposing FarceDon't you smile at my faceSpit on my backDo you kiss your mother with a mouth like that?]

Well, the thing is that most fanfiction- like most anything, especially fan-anything- is just plain bad. It always has been and it always will be, no matter where you go or what property you're looking at.

Really, the thing that strikes me as uniqute about FiM fanfics is something that serves as kind of a curse in disguise: for better or for worse, we've got a specific site- Equestria Daily- that serves as the most prominent, recognizable aggregator of show news and fan content and that at least applies a certain basic standard of quality to the fanfiction it posts (even if that standard is dubious at best). This seems like it's a good thing on the surface, but the unfortunate aspect is that the site's staff (and often readership) is, well... weird, to put it politely. They've got weird tastes and they like weird things and the end result is that there are way more grimdark shipping crossovers floating around than there should be, all because Sethisto is kind of a creep.

That's just conjecture, of course, but I do believe it's at least part of the reason FiM has- or at least seems to have- even more bad/stupid fanfiction than the average property. (Personally, I think the best thing that could happen to this fandom is EqD being supplanted by a different site that applies a standard of quality similar to ours, but that's a subject for another time.)

For my part, part of the reason I decided to take the plunge and write out dumb pony stories every now and then is because I decided that I wanted to contribute in a positive way to the fandom. I figure that, if nothing else, I can be sure there's one person out there who's not writing grimdark or shipping and who's at least making an attempt to write things that fit the tone/setting of the show.

And, I must say, I don't get why people love Fallout Equestria so much. Too many OCs for my taste, it's as if it's hardly MLP-related at all, maybe except for name and references to MLP.

I haven't read all of FO:E, and I don't intend to, but I did read a little bit of it to try and figure out why it's so popular, and you're right: the "Equestria" part is little more than a layer of aesthetic gloss; it's essentially Fallout fanfiction (or potentially even an original work if you tweaked it enough) with ponies tacked on just because. The prose itself actually isn't that bad, and it seemed like there might be the inklings of an interesting post-apocalyptic story in there somewhere, but I think the most important part is that it hits a lot of the right buttons to appeal to the EqD demographic: "hey I like [insert franchise here]," "epic" length that means it's constantly getting bumped to the top of the blog whenever a new chapter comes out, a story structure that's laid out like a series of quests in a video game, and lesbianism.

[BattyBovine♪ i got a new way to walk ♪♪ walk walk ♪♪ i got a new way to walk ♪♪ walk walk ♪♪ i got a new way to walk ♪♪ and it shows how good i feel ♪]

This is all basically my feeling as well. The most frustrating thing about almost all of the fanfiction I've read is that it's entirely out of tone with the show, to the point that the only similarity between the two are the fact that the characters are horses. I don't quite understand how so many people have trouble with it. I admit I haven't written much, but really all you have to do is say to yourself, "could this happen in a show for preschoolers?" Or at least, "would I show this to my preschool-age daughter?" The rest is just incorporating the things you love about the show into your work -- like any fanfic writer would (or should) do anyway. I'm forgiving of some out-of-character behaviour if the rest of the story makes up for it, but there's no reason why someone can't write a completely innocent story using the beloved characters from the show rather than trying to compensate by forcing the show to be something it's not. At that point, it all but ceases to be fanfiction. It's just a bad piece of fiction that borrows other people's characters as a storytelling vehicle.

And in particular, the entire concept of the "human in Equestria" stories annoys the crap out of me. I've never read one that wasn't some kind of self-insert wish fulfilment fantasy, which is only ever fun for the author.

For my part, part of the reason I decided to take the plunge and write out dumb pony stories every now and then is because I decided that I wanted to contribute in a positive way to the fandom. I figure that, if nothing else, I can be sure there's at least one person out there who's not writing grimdark or shipping and who's at least making an attempt to write things that fit the tone/setting of the show.

Same here. I've yet to write a whole lot, but I want to for pretty much this reason. I'm not very good at writing anything that isn't large blocks of informational text, but I see My Little Pony fanfiction as a way to both improve my skill, and contribute something that I feel is lacking in most other My Little Pony fanfiction: good, clean fun.

[XX55XX]

Yeah, but like you said, MLP: FiM is unique in that it is filled with more crappy fan fiction than any other media franchise whose fan fiction I've laid my eyes on. All of the media franchises I've mentioned (Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Harry Potter, A Series of Unfortunate Events, etc.) all have their solid collection of excellent fanfics, even they make up a minority of all of the fanfic written out there for these franchises. That is to be expected.

But, when it comes to MLP: FiM, I can safely say that there are only very, very, very few fics actually worth sinking your teeth into. Most of it is lowbrow stuff or crazy crossover stuff that doesn't make a lot of sense. There is plenty of average stuff, too, but I usually skim through it and move onto the next story.

Granted, I'm not the best writer either, so some of my criticism might come off as harsh or hypocritical - I have written quite a bit of MLP: FiM fan fiction myself and have had my work rejected by EQD.

[Huitzil]

Yeah, but like you said, MLP: FiM is unique in that it is filled with more crappy fan fiction than any other media franchise whose fan fiction I've laid my eyes on. All of the media franchises I've mentioned (Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Harry Potter, A Series of Unfortunate Events, etc.) all have their solid collection of excellent fanfics, even they make up a minority of all of the fanfic written out there for these franchises. That is to be expected.

But, when it comes to MLP: FiM, I can safely say that there are only very, very, very few fics actually worth sinking your teeth into. Most of it is lowbrow stuff or crazy crossover stuff that doesn't make a lot of sense. There is plenty of average stuff, too, but I usually skim through it and move onto the next story.

Granted, I'm not the best writer either, so some of my criticism might come off as harsh or hypocritical - I have written quite a bit of MLP: FiM fan fiction myself and have had my work rejected by EQD.

Well, did all the good, "solid" fanfics for all those other franchises come out within one year of their original source material? Because that's kind of where we are right now.

Also OpposingFarce it's pretty dumb to say "Sethisto likes different things than I do, what a horrible creep." Every fanfic community believes it is plagued with the worst, laziest fics, and laments how they've got it even worse than other communities. And it always just boils down to "I hate how people write things they like instead of what I like, the community would be objectively better if it catered more to my personal tastes."

And I like crossover fics. Even if the author can't make the story work, it's fun to see how they try to incorporate the existence of two completely dissimilar universes like ponies and, well, anything else. Stuff like "Celestia was the former First Prime of the Goa'uld Epona, and cutie marks are derived from Jaffa loyalty markings!" is just fun in an unapologetically geeky way.

[Opposing FarceDon't you smile at my faceSpit on my backDo you kiss your mother with a mouth like that?]

Also OpposingFarce it's pretty dumb to say "Sethisto likes different things than I do, what a horrible creep." Every fanfic community believes it is plagued with the worst, laziest fics, and laments how they've got it even worse than other communities. And it always just boils down to "I hate how people write things they like instead of what I like, the community would be objectively better if it catered more to my personal tastes."

See, normally I'm with you on that, it's just that in this case the different thing in question is, erm, "saucy" fan content involving candy-colored cartoon ponies.

[Humorless ClodNo fun. Not ever.]

Well, did all the good, "solid" fanfics for all those other franchises come out within one year of their original source material? Because that's kind of where we are right now.

Also OpposingFarce it's pretty dumb to say "Sethisto likes different things than I do, what a horrible creep." Every fanfic community believes it is plagued with the worst, laziest fics, and laments how they've got it even worse than other communities. And it always just boils down to "I hate how people write things they like instead of what I like, the community would be objectively better if it catered more to my personal tastes."

And I like crossover fics. Even if the author can't make the story work, it's fun to see how they try to incorporate the existence of two completely dissimilar universes like ponies and, well, anything else. Stuff like "Celestia was the former First Prime of the Goa'uld Epona, and cutie marks are derived from Jaffa loyalty markings!" is just fun in an unapologetically geeky way.

I feel I have to disagree simply because there is a big difference between 'This fanfic is bad because I don't like it/it doesn't cater to my wish-fulfillment/personal pleasures' and 'this fanfic is bad because it is poorly written, poorly constructed, and poorly thought-out.' There's a difference between 'something of good quality' and 'something that tickles one's geek sweet spots.'

I don't think this fandom is any WORSE than any other fandom, or that it's somehow the worst fandom for fanfic ever. But I do think that it has a unique situation and contains unique versions of fanfic trends I've seen before. When this fandom makes a bad fic, it makes a different kind of bad fic than any other place I've been to thus far. That's fascinating to me, really.

[Huitzil]

See, normally I'm with you on that, it's just that in this case the different thing in question is, erm, "saucy" fan content involving candy-colored cartoon ponies.

What do you mean by "saucy"? Because last I checked EqD doesn't allow porn fics, and far as I can tell they use "shipping" the way almost every non-ponygoons fan uses it: "lovey-dovey romance," not "eww disgusting pornography".

[Opposing FarceDon't you smile at my faceSpit on my backDo you kiss your mother with a mouth like that?]

What do you mean by "saucy"? Because last I checked EqD doesn't allow porn fics, and far as I can tell they use "shipping" the way almost every non-ponygoons fan uses it: "lovey-dovey romance," not "eww disgusting pornography".

"Saucy" here means whatever Seth uses it to mean. EqD doesn't allow outright porn, but they get pretty damn close at times.

[Huitzil]

I feel I have to disagree simply because there is a big difference between 'This fanfic is bad because I don't like it/it doesn't cater to my wish-fulfillment/personal pleasures' and 'this fanfic is bad because it is poorly written, poorly constructed, and poorly thought-out.' There's a difference between 'something of good quality' and 'something that tickles one's geek sweet spots.'

But the problem of things being poor quality is a constant in all fandoms as well as all things that are not fandoms, so that can't be used as a justification to say why the fandom you are most familiar with is also the worst. The complaints here aren't primarily about technical quality, as that's known to be constant, they are "people write fics that I don't like."

I don't think this fandom is any WORSE than any other fandom,

Well, most of the people I am responding to apparently do, so that was why I was responding to them.

[Opposing FarceDon't you smile at my faceSpit on my backDo you kiss your mother with a mouth like that?]

I'm not necessarily saying that FiM is unique in that its fanfiction is worse than any other property, but rather that it seems as though there are more stories that don't mach the tone/style of the show at all than in the average fandom. For example, if you think about some of the most popular/notable fanfictions (Past Sins, Fallout: Equestria, that stupid fucking Cupcakes thing), they're undeniably very different from the show proper both in terms of content and in terms of form; of course, there are probably lots of properties for which that's true, but even so it seems odd that something which is supposed to be based on the show often ends up having a very different 'feel' to the show itself, doesn't it?

[Huitzil]

I'm not necessarily saying that FiM is unique in that its fanfiction is worse than any other property, but rather that it seems as though there are more stories that don't mach the tone/style of the show at all than in the average fandom. For example, if you think about some of the most popular/notable fanfictions (Past Sins, Fallout: Equestria, that stupid fucking Cupcakes thing), they're undeniably very different from the show proper both in terms of content and in terms of form; of course, there are probably lots of properties for which that's true, but even so it seems odd that something which is supposed to be based on the show often ends up having a very different 'feel' to the show itself, doesn't it?

That's just conjecture, of course, but I do believe it's at least part of the reason FiM has- or at least seems to have- even more bad/stupid fanfiction than the average property. (Personally, I think the best thing that could happen to this fandom is EqD being supplanted by a different site that applies a standard of quality similar to ours, but that's a subject for another time.)

That's you saying you think FiM's fanfic is worse than other properties', and pretty much you saying "the fandom would be better if other people's tastes were closer to mine."

And no, I don't think it's odd at all that many of the popular fanfics don't match the tone of the show, because that's true of pretty much every fandom. It's the same reason why out-of-genre covers of songs sound cooler or more memorable than the originals no matter what genre the original was.

[Opposing FarceDon't you smile at my faceSpit on my backDo you kiss your mother with a mouth like that?]

That's you saying you think FiM's fanfic is worse than other properties', and pretty much you saying "the fandom would be better if other people's tastes were closer to mine."

Actually I meant it as more "the fandom would be better if it spent less time writing about ponies killing and/or sleeping with each other."

[Humorless ClodNo fun. Not ever.]

But the problem of things being poor quality is a constant in all fandoms as well as all things that are not fandoms, so that can't be used as a justification to say why the fandom you are most familiar with is also the worst

I... what? What does this mean? I am not sure I am understanding your point. Let me... let me try...

-But the problem of things being poor quality is a constant in all fandoms as well as things that are not fandoms

A true statement, but a simplification. There are many ways something can be of poor quality. My point was that the ways the fic is bad are different than many other fandoms. Just saying things are bad everywhere sort of shunts the issue of quality aside as a nonissue. I do think it needs to be talked about. Otherwise it can't be fixed!

-so that can't be used as a justification to say why the fandom you are most familiar with is also the worst
Who... said this? When? I am fairly sure the issue you brought up was a response to my post, yet... I didn't say this. Where did you get this?

The complaints here aren't primarily about technical quality, as that's known to be constant, they are "people write fics that I don't like."

So basically you see the primary conflict being about people whining that their geek-egos aren't being stroked? Where are these people you are talking about?

[Opposing FarceDon't you smile at my faceSpit on my backDo you kiss your mother with a mouth like that?]

I feel like this discussion is getting a little too confrontational, so let me try to pull it back for a minute and be a bit more cordial about this.

Huitzil, I get where you're coming from, I really do. I'm normally right there with you when it comes to "okay guys come on you're being kind of silly with the fan-bashing." In this case, though, I think we're having a bit of a miscommunication, which is my fault for wording things poorly up to this point, so let me try to be clear about my position here:

I recognize that my personal thoughts on what I think fanfiction should aim to be are just my opinion; I think the ideal thing to do is to explore parts of the characters or setting that the show doesn't address in a way that fits the tone and style of the original work, but that's not how everyone does it and that's okay. Still, I do believe that grimdark, shipping, most crossover stories, etc. are kind of inherently stupid and that fanfiction in general would be viewed more favorably if that stuff didn't get promoted on sites like EqD. Also, while I do feel that there are unique elements to the distribution/style/quality of FiM fanfics, I don't think you can really say that they're particularly worse than any other property's.

[Humorless ClodNo fun. Not ever.]

Actually I meant it as more "the fandom would be better if it spent less time writing about ponies killing and/or sleeping with each other."

To kind of clarify, I see what OpposingFarce is talking about. We're all here to see the characters and world from the show, right? That is what we are fans of. So putting them in too many things with vastly different tone and mood without thinking about the repercussions of it messes up the depiction of the character and the setting.

Not to say crossovers can't happen. But really, it's a give-and-take. To make a great crossover, one has to figure out how BOTH CONTINUA are relevant to each other. Just plopping ponies down any old place really makes the ponies lose their meaning: they depend on Equestria, living there, knowing knowledge from there, making Equestrian assumptions, for their identities. If a pony has a totally different background, a totally un-pony-like job, in a world that could not produce ponies as we know them, is not expected to act the way a pony would act, raised in situations where behaving like a normal pony might get her killed... is this still a pony? No. It's just something that the story tells us is like a pony from the show, but doesn't prove it. Really, to write crossover fiction about ponies, ponies have to be 'enabled' in the 'host' continuum. The author exploring themes of friendship, with show-like values might do wonders in making an otherwise dubiously hostile continuum more suitable for a crossover. One that isn't a cheap one-off to rub somebody's geek buttons or for lulz.

It's not so much 'I DON'T LIKE STORIES SO THEY ARE BAD' as much as poor construction prevents a lot of stories from being good... and part of constructing a story with ponies is... adding... ponies. If one fails to add in BOTH continuums in equal measures (Or at least measures that enable both to have equal presence in the story) then that story might end up bad. Simply because one aspect of the tone is hogging the spotlight and as a result, the other half of the crossover cast has to spin wildly OOC to coexist. Which is not what we're all fans of the show to see happen.

[numsOic]

I'm not necessarily saying that FiM is unique in that its fanfiction is worse than any other property, but rather that it seems as though there are more stories that don't mach the tone/style of the show at all than in the average fandom.

That's probably because the majority of the fanfics you're seeing are being written by adults (of any gender) when the intended audience is 6-to-9-year-old girls, so the interests of fanfic writers are going to be very divergent from what the show offers. I've seen the same thing in fanart with the deluge of crossover/grimdark images that don't really match the show's tone in any way, nice though many of them may be. It's not just a fanfic thing, in my view.

[Concerned ReaderI didn't inhale]

The approach I always take when writing is to write from the point of view of the characters. So for a story about magical pastel colored ponies, I try and get into the head and narrative voice of a pony with regards to the show. It's not always easy, but it can help a lot with getting the tone right for what you're actually writing about.

Of course Spikes Day Off.txt was written pretty much entirely as a meta joke, but even then, when writing my parts of that I made careful choices in word usage, description, and dialog to get the desired tone.

When doing Falling From High Places, the entire idea behind it was to basically write a editorial article from the perspective of a pegasus reporter. The entire POV of the article was designed with that in mind, which is kinda why I used a pseudonym, so as not to ruin the illusion. Also because I wanted to make a new DA for my pony fiction if I ever get around to writing more.

Something I think matches the tone of the show very well, while still being a truly unique and well told story, is Stormy Nights by our very own VoidChicken.

Yeah, but like you said, MLP: FiM is unique in that it is filled with more crappy fan fiction than any other media franchise whose fan fiction I've laid my eyes on. All of the media franchises I've mentioned (Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Harry Potter, A Series of Unfortunate Events, etc.) all have their solid collection of excellent fanfics, even they make up a minority of all of the fanfic written out there for these franchises. That is to be expected.

Part of it is the demographics like nums0ic pointed out, and part of it is the relative age of the fandom, and another part of it is probably related to the fact that 4chan was basically the starting point for a lot of the fandom. I still don't believe that it is filled with any more crap then say, the sonic fandom. There's some law that states 95% of everything is crap, and that applies to everything. It's just that when you've got 60000 fanfics from a fandom that is 10 years old, that 5% looks a lot bigger.

FiM is an ill-defined world. The basic framework is in place to support the show, but the actual canon world building is relatively low. This is a driving force in some of the creative fan works, including fan art, fan fiction, and fan rpgs. We've basically got a shared story universe with a ton of blank spots to fill with our own ideas.

Granted, I'm not the best writer either, so some of my criticism might come off as harsh or hypocritical - I have written quite a bit of MLP: FiM fan fiction myself and have had my work rejected by EQD.

We've got an editing thread if you want to give that a try. I actually submitted Falling From High Places to EQD and it was auto rejected without being read for being too short.

[kefkafloyd]

I think we can have a constructive discussion on the state of fanfiction in this fandom. Huitzil, don't be a pedant in this thread and ruin it.

[TailspinQueen of the skies]

And I like crossover fics. Even if the author can't make the story work, it's fun to see how they try to incorporate the existence of two completely dissimilar universes like ponies and, well, anything else.

With crossovers it works far better when the author can mesh the two universes together, otherwise it all feels out of place. If you ask me, that's the whole point of crossovers. Not many (if any at all) MLP crossover fanfics have managed to achive this.

[Concerned ReaderI didn't inhale]

With crossovers it works far better when the author can mesh the two universes together, otherwise it all feels out of place. If you ask me, that's the whole point of crossovers. Not many (if any at all) MLP crossover fanfics have managed to achive this.

I think part of the reason for this is the tonal difference between MLP and pretty much any property that it could be crossed with. Or rather the tonal difference between it and the properties that the older demographic, which makes up most of the fanfic writer sect, will cross it with. Add to this market trends like Zombies or Vampires, or whatever teen paranormal romance thing is hot, and you get people shoving ponies into settings that don't really support them.

Then again, I am currently running an rpg where Feferi Peixes is riding on Luna's back and trying to stab Discord with a Trident as the Land of Dew and Glass is shattering around them.

[XX55XX]

Some crossovers do work, however, and some are even a pleasure to read. I find the Doctor Who crossovers to be the best ones. I mean, the premise just fits. The Doctor travels between various universes, and why can't one of those universes be Equestria? It just works. I am amazed that it does (at least for me).

I'm personally still working on an Invader Zim crossover (which I think works quite well).

[Concerned ReaderI didn't inhale]

Some crossovers do work, however, and some are even a pleasure to read. I find the Doctor Who crossovers to be the best ones. I mean, the premise just fits. The Doctor travels between various universes, and why can't one of those universes be Equestria? It just works. I am amazed that it does (at least for me).

I'm personally still working on an Invader Zim crossover (which I think works quite well).

See but both of these properties are conducive to a pony crossover, in that they both have a fairly high "wacky" quotient. Their story universes are designed for things to be out of the ordinary at almost all times, so introducing ponies doesn't really do anything to upset that balance. Doctor Who, by design, is almost never surprised by anything. So him randomly running across a world of talking ponies can be taken almost entirely in stride. Invader Zim does have an added grimdark quotient though, so that's something to be careful of.

Thinking about it, a Megas XLR crossover would probably work pretty well.

[XX55XX]

Invader Zim does have an added grimdark quotient though, so that's something to be careful of.

Invader Zim isn't really grimdark. Grimdark connotes something more serious. Invader Zim, however, is more black comedy/satire than anything. Which meshes with pony humor quite well, in my opinion.

[Opposing FarceDon't you smile at my faceSpit on my backDo you kiss your mother with a mouth like that?]

Invader Zim isn't really grimdark. Grimdark connotes something more serious. Invader Zim, however, is more black comedy/satire than anything. Which meshes with pony humor quite well, in my opinion.

The term "grimdark" comes from a 40k quote, and from what I understand 40k is at least supposed to be satire.

[XX55XX]

The term "grimdark" comes from a 40k quote, and from what I understand 40k is at least supposed to be satire.

Just looked up a definition of it. It's quite broad, but from what I can discern, grimdark is a state of existence in which everyone is a miser and atrocities/massacres/bad news/totalitarianism/short lifespans/misanthropy is the order of the day. While Invader Zim does fit into that mold somewhat, it doesn't completely fill it. Misanthropy is quite common in Invader Zim, I'll give you that, though.

[Concerned ReaderI didn't inhale]

Just looked up a definition of it. It's quite broad, but from what I can discern, grimdark is a state of existence in which everyone is a miser and atrocities/massacres/bad news/totalitarianism/short lifespans/misanthropy is the order of the day. While Invader Zim does fit into that mold somewhat, it doesn't completely fill it. Misanthropy is quite common in Invader Zim, I'll give you that, though.

Well, I said it had a high grimdark quotient, not that it was entirely grimdark. I mean just look at Dark Harvest.

[XX55XX]

Well, I said it had a high grimdark quotient, not that it was entirely grimdark. I mean just look at Dark Harvest.

That was one of the best Invader Zim episodes ever.

Actually, my Invader Zim crossover fic includes kidnapping, impersonation, and stolen identities. Not too bad, but what is Zim going to do?

Personally, I'm not against grimdark so long as it is written well and not taken to extraordinary extremes. And with the ponies remaining in-character. It sometimes works - I mean, "Pony Psychology" is pretty dark at times, for example, and it's one of my personal favorites.

[Redeye]

People seem to misuse grimdark to refer to any kinda dark content. Let it be understood--"grimdark" refers to a point when there is absolutely no hope, everything sucks, and atrocities are the order of the day. Which is why it refers to 40K, there's no shades brighter than gray in that universe.

The thing is that MLP is the exact opposite, a "noblebright" as /tg/ refers to it--so it doesn't really work trying to make MLP dark and hopeless any more than it would to try and make 40K any brighter than the sort of wry, barely-surviving humor you get from the Ciaphas Cain novels. When people try it just feels out of place and trying-too-hard, at least to me.

[Daionus The 23rd:3]

That was one of the best Invader Zim episodes ever.

Actually, my Invader Zim crossover fic includes kidnapping, impersonation, and stolen identities. Not too bad, but what is Zim going to do?

Personally, I'm not against grimdark so long as it is written well and not taken to extraordinary extremes. And with the ponies remaining in-character. It sometimes works - I mean, "Pony Psychology" is pretty dark at times, for example, and it's one of my personal favorites.

That better be referring to a character locking some pony in a closet and putting on a crappy pony costume.