S02E05: Sisterhooves Social

[AramekYour MRI results have shown total infection to now be approximately one fifth of the full mass of the tissue."So you're saying..."Your brain is about 20% tumor.]

Can you watch it on, say, a normal computer monitor in HD, or do you have to have an iPad?

[Lazy]

...only just now really giving it its full due now that I'm pulling the episodes down properly and enjoying them on weekends instead of just in stolen 22-minute chunks at work on my phone (which is how I watched pretty much the entire show up till recently).

Whaaat
How long did this go on?
You were missing out on so much of the animation watching everything on a phone.

[Headless Horse]

I'm just saying the eye-screen viewing distance seems to really hit a sweet spot this way. Laptop should do just as well, but I found holding it at tablet length meant I was getting about the same kind of experience as if I was sitting in a movie theater, right down in the last row of the floor seating before the stadium seats. Which coincidentally is about how the directing feels: they're treating it like it's in Panavision or something.


E: ^^^ Oh, I know. Believe me, I know. I'm as smitten by the animation as the next guy; this just meant I had to work a little harder to get at it. I would often go back and rewatch little bits on Youtube, or pay close attention to things once I knew they were coming, but it's not lost on me that a phone isn't the most ideal way to do ponies. I'll take what I can get, though.

[Lazy]

I'm just saying the eye-screen viewing distance seems to really hit a sweet spot this way. Laptop should do just as well, but I found holding it at tablet length meant I was getting about the same kind of experience as if I was sitting in a movie theater, right down in the last row of the floor seating before the stadium seats.

Yeah, if you don't have a nice setup for your desktop it can be fairly awkward, and viewing laptops at a good angle is a pain.

Can you watch it on, say, a normal computer monitor in HD, or do you have to have an iPad?

As long as you have a decent sized monitor, yeah.
Go to your Control settings/Display/Screen resolution. As long as your maximum is 1,280x720 or higher, you'll be able to see it in HD properly, and having it somewhat less than that shouldn't hurt much.

[BouncyPonySo.... you better Watch Out!]

I also just watched it in HD right up close on an iPad, and that really is such an ideal way to watch this show, I'm realizing;

Yes, once you go 1080p, it's so hard to go back. Saturdays can be tough, having to find something to do while everyone is enjoying a new episode. But once the high-def stream is posted, I can curl up back in bed with my iPad (cold and rainy today!) and enjoy this beautiful, beautiful show.

[Headless Horse]

Gonna move this here because yay episode threads!

Eh, we'll just have to disagree then; I wasn't surprised at all when Rarity was revealed to have been in the race, and Rarity getting down and dirty to help out a friend (or in this case, sister) has already been a thing before that she's done so, while it was indeed a cool emotional moment, it felt more like a natural thing for Rarity to do instead of a big surprise out of nowhere, and it was something that was obviously built up within the episode already. I don't know how to explain it better, but it's like when I rewatch the episode, I can already see by the time it hits the race that Rarity very much is going to do something big to save her relationship with her sister thanks to the previous scene at the camp, and knowing ahead of time that Rarity is going to be in the race doesn't add anything to the race itself thanks to the large build up. I suppose if you would be surprised at Rarity getting athletic/dirty for something she cares about (I wasn't, but I guess everyone else was), then I could see something new from that scene being added.

Somewhat related to what you said, I'd compare Rarity getting into the uncouth race to Fluttershy busting out the stare in Dragonshy for the first time and that being the pinnacle versus the Stare in Stare Master where the action isn't as important as the underlying character in the scene. They both had establishing moments (Dragonshy and Look Before You sleep/other Rarity things) where it's supposed to be surprising for the character and is character growth, and a moment where it is brought up again (Stare Master and Sisterhooves Social) but the importance doesn't lie in the action itself but for the underlying character, which is going the extra mile for Sweetie Belle/CMC for both cases. My beef on this particular point with Sisterhooves Social is that the underlying element is Rarity overcoming herself for the sake of her sister, but that was something that was already built up twice in different scenes in that episode by the time you get to the Race so the race felt very much like falling action than a climax per say in that the elements have already been set up, so nothing new really comes into play from the change in perspective when you know Rarity is in the race. To compare it to Harry Potter, I'd imagine it being like what if Snape's love for Harry's mother Lily was something explicitly built up over the entire series versus how in actuality it only becomes apparent in books 5 till the end; there would still be good character there, no doubt, but it wouldn't have that same type of impact because it was something more obvious to the audience.


...


It's alright to spoil Harry Potter nowadays...right?

This all may well be true, but I don't think it refutes the idea that—at least for some, including me—watching the episode after knowing the twist is a way different experience from watching it the first time.

You're saying the twist was predictable, and maybe it was. But if we grant that someone watching the episode for the first time doesn't guess that the muddy pony is Rarity and not Applejack, then for that first time through, the narrative is about watching what we think is Sweetie Belle and Applejack having a grand old time bonding like fake sisters during the race. The twist comes along and shows us that it's Rarity, and then it's only in retrospect that we realize what happened.

On subsequent viewings, we know it's Rarity, and we see it as her displaying tremendous competence at all these games and kicking ass at all the gymkhana events that are really farmyard chores—echoes of The Karate Kid, or perhaps the training scenes in Mulan. We realize that she must have had one hell of a tutoring session under AJ that night, and we see her just silently running her race and soaking up Sweetie Belle's seemingly displaced sisterly affection—knowing that she can't reveal herself until the end because SB is mad at her. But we see that expression on Rarity's face throughout the whole thing where we can just see her thinking, "Oh, this is so worth it. Why didn't I do this kind of thing with her sooner?"

To your point, during the race I'm not thinking about prior occasions where Rarity has self-sacrificed for others' benefit or anything like that. All I'm thinking about is "Whoa, she learned how to do that tossing-apples-into-a-bucket-and-doing-the-midair-body-block thing that Sweetie Belle has also picked up from Apple Bloom? Oh, and flinging all those stainy grapes into the vat too? And oh man, look at her face during the egg scene! Aww! "

But I'm one of those people who didn't see the twist coming, and so for me at least, the first time through was a very different narrative experience. And ever since then it's been one of the most intensely emotional and affecting sequences in the whole show.



Edit: The fact that the race events are echoes of the farmyard chores that Applejack and Apple Bloom are already good at (and probably none of the other contestants) is a big part of the head-fake; it leads you down the path of thinking, "Oh huh, so that's why AJ and AB enter this every year—they've got an unfair advantage." It keeps you—okay, well, me—from second-guessing the plot (and looking too closely at the eyes) and figuring it out early.

[itinerant nomadSurprise Pedantry!]

My interpretation of the race on my first viewing sort of lies in the middle, in that I didn't know to expect Rarity entering the race when it seemed clear Applejack had stepped in as the big sister. However, the show didn't cheap out and fail to add details inconsistent with her being the pony covered in mud during the race.

Once I picked up on that, the race had an added dimension I think would have been missing if you weren't certain until the big reveal at the end. In the latter case, the primary thought is "WTF it's Rarity" and not as much attention is paid to what is receding from short-term memory. If you know what to look for already, there's a clearer progression through the answers to the questions we have after Rarity swears to make things right. We may have asked what could Rarity do to convince her sister to give her another chance. There's the question of just how far Rarity would go.
We see in the race that she's willing to go through a lot of crap and to accept things she looked down upon earlier in the show. All the while, her primary focus despite the blow to her dignity is that her sister's experience is the one she tends to.

I spent later viewings seeing how Rarity's disguise has imperfections that become more obvious as the race goes on.
It's not a master illusion, but enough to pass for a little sister, and maybe for those not as versed in TV Tropes.
This is a small example of one of the things I think the show does strive to do now and again, in telling a story that internally consists of parallel narratives that can appeal on a level less sophisticated and on a level of a more jaded viewer.

We have the "OMG big sister surprise" narrative, and we have the narrative of the big sister making the surprise happen.
Echoing some earlier discussion, giving the players in the simpler narrative motivations and actions that fit a more complex story can strengthen the simpler story even if the latter is not spelled out.
It's sort of like how as young children we see adults doing all these things for reasons we won't really understand until much later, but the fact that there's something underpinning everything can really help the whole presentation hold together.

[CorpusCavernosumThe bear and the unicorn fair]

This episode was on this morning. What a great episode. Every time I watch it I pick up on new facial expressions and body language by the characters. The background music really stood out on rewatch, too.

[Twilight"First I'm turned into a princess...Now I'm a WHAT!?I can't catch a break."]

I also love this one. There really isn't anything wrong with it I can point out. (Well, killing chicken eggs is a bit out of place but I just ignore it like Pinkie saying she wants to eat a hot dog)

[PloboWhat'cha want me to do with this? Go pranking?I threw it on the ground!]

Ponygoons'™ favourite!

[CorpusCavernosumThe bear and the unicorn fair]

I also love this one. There really isn't anything wrong with it I can point out. (Well, killing chicken eggs is a bit out of place but I just ignore it like Pinkie saying she wants to eat a hot dog)

Eggs that you cook are unfertilized; they're no more alive than the stuff that comes out of human ladies during their monthly.

[Twilight"First I'm turned into a princess...Now I'm a WHAT!?I can't catch a break."]

Eggs that you cook are unfertilized; they're no more alive than the stuff that comes out of human ladies during their monthly.

But weren't these fresh eggs right from the coop?

[CorpusCavernosumThe bear and the unicorn fair]

But weren't these fresh eggs right from the coop?

Yes, but eggs cannot be fertilized once they are outside the hen. The egg is fertilized while inside the hen, then laid a day or two later. If an egg is not fertilized, it's laid the same way. If the egg was fertilized, you'd be able to see the embryo once it was cracked.

Basically, if they don't keep roosters inside the chicken coop with hen-laying eggs, there's no way for the eggs to be fertilized.

[Headless Horse]

Ponies eating eggs for breakfast, though... now that's a conundrum.

[Twilight"First I'm turned into a princess...Now I'm a WHAT!?I can't catch a break."]

Yes, but eggs cannot be fertilized once they are outside the hen. The egg is fertilized while inside the hen, then laid a day or two later. If an egg is not fertilized, it's laid the same way. If the egg was fertilized, you'd be able to see the embryo once it was cracked.

Basically, if they don't keep roosters inside the chicken coop with hen-laying eggs, there's no way for the eggs to be fertilized.

Right... isn't that what I basically was getting at? We don't know if there were any roosters in there. (as in, there could have been)

[CorpusCavernosumThe bear and the unicorn fair]

Right... isn't that what I basically was getting at? We don't know if there were any roosters in there. (as in, there could have been)

We got a good enough look at the eggs to know that they weren't fertilized...

Or perhaps they were a textured hay protein egg substitute.

[Twilight"First I'm turned into a princess...Now I'm a WHAT!?I can't catch a break."]

We got a good enough look at the eggs to know that they weren't fertilized...

Or perhaps they were a textured hay protein egg substitute.

You know just what I want to hear

[Daionus The 23rd:3]

I don't get what you guys are talking about. Ponies are vegetarian, not vegan.

[Pocketis she just gonna go booty booty]

Well, they're supposed to be herbivores, more than anything else. Which makes the idea of them just stone cold eating plain fried eggs a little harder to swallow than if they were people who happen to be vegetarians. Pastries that are made with eggs I can accept, for some reason. Maybe because I still think of them as a bread-like thing.

[Applepie]

Having rewatched this episode now after Cutie Pox is out, I am really quite blown away with how god damned good it is.

One of my all time favorite episodes.

[fensterawethome~!]

quoting me

That's cool and all, but can someone show me where I posted that quote again? I honestly don't remember saying that.

[Headless Horse]

Looks like here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1633&p=227488#p227488

[AlliterativeAxolotlHonorary Cutie Mark Crusader]

Well, they're supposed to be herbivores, more than anything else. Which makes the idea of them just stone cold eating plain fried eggs a little harder to swallow than if they were people who happen to be vegetarians. Pastries that are made with eggs I can accept, for some reason. Maybe because I still think of them as a bread-like thing.

Now I don't want to scare anyone here but horses and ponies are apparently known for eating a smaller rodent here and then.
Like, a bunny for example Not often, though, but it seems to happen.

[Lazy]

Horses IRL are often kind of assholes.
Wild ones, anyways.

[CorpusCavernosumThe bear and the unicorn fair]

Actually, it's not unheard of to feed eggs to show-horses. The nutrients in eggs can make a horse's coat shinier and are good for their mane. That pretty much covers why Rarity would be eating them.

[MirAbsolutely nothing could go wrong.]

Opening with Rarity, who appears to be about to die a horrible fiery death.

Hehe, Sweetie belle is the best cook.
Woah... Parents out of nowhere.
You can just tell she loves them, but there's absolutely nothing about her parents that doesn't drive her insane.

Burnt juice and black liquid toast. Sweetie belle is the best cook.

heh, her expressions are so innocent.

aww... Poor Sweetie. She's so adorably enthusiastic. Each time she screws up, she's just downcast for a few seconds before on to her next misadventure.
Rarity's facial expressions. She's definately bringing this stuff on herself, but on the other hand, I had a little brother who used to destroy my room on a regular basis so I can sorta relate.

Applebloom with a title drop.

ohh... that could have gone better.

Ha, rotten apple to the horn!

hmm... These scenes with Rarity would probably feel stronger if all of Sweetie's mistakes weren't turning out positive. It kinda overshadows the fact that even if she messed up it was done with the best intentions.

The sheep can talk.

Aww, that is a cute drawing... It actually looks like a kid made it too.
That's quite an act, Rarity.

Ouch, rejected. AJ's face just says she wants no part of this.

hmm... Wondering when Rarity is gonna show up...

Aww, cute. "One day."

heh "One Day"

Ugh, eye poke.

Oh ho! I noticed AJ's eyes were suddenly blue durring the apple toss scene, but thought it might have been an animation error...

I've got one of those big dumb grins on my face right now.

Some interesting hair styles.

Feeling kinda sappy at the moment. Reminds me of my littler brother, but even more so, some of the kids I used to watch once in a while, since the age difference is closer. Maybe it's just me, but this episode seemed particularly well written, as far as the character interaction and dialog went. Gonna be feeling the warm fuzzies for a while.

[Twilight"First I'm turned into a princess...Now I'm a WHAT!?I can't catch a break."]

Oh ho! I noticed AJ's eyes were suddenly blue durring the apple toss scene, but thought it might have been an animation error...

This is the part I was waiting for. I didn't catch this at all in the end, and totally fell for this one. This plot twist was well done, though I'm not sure how the mud on the body thing didn't key me off before. I just did not see this one coming at all.

[Kitty KateUnstoppably adorable]

I only noticed that something was 'off', I didn't even know it was the eyes

[MirAbsolutely nothing could go wrong.]

Yeah, I sorta only half noticed it. The eyes caught my attention when I said they did, but I was kinda into the action and it was all happening so fast that I didn't really reach the conclusion to what it actually meant until the race was more or less finished.
Even though I watch them on Youtube, I don't like pausing in the middle of a scene.

[kefkafloyd]

They had me the whole way through up until the egg bit. I was wondering "Man, they better wrap this up pretty soon, the episode is almost over!" and then I saw the bit with the close-up on the eyes. I saw the blue eye and then I knew it was Rarity. That's how you fake somebody out.

[Headless Horse]

Mir, now you get to see what is my favorite thing about this episode: it actually gets better once you know the twist.

Now that you're aware from the beginning that it's Rarity under the mud, the entire race just becomes a whole nother level of heartwarming. Just look at that I'm-finally-doing-sisterhood-right expression on her face.

It's a great twist episode to a first-timer, but it actually improves with familiarity, and that's a rare and wonderful thing.

[Stuff]

This is such an adorable and heartwarming episode. Like many of you, I thought the blue eyes were an animation error as well, but it hit me when the race was about to end. That's Rarity being a great sister!

This is also the best thread: check the bottom of page 2 to see a newbie.

[Twilight"First I'm turned into a princess...Now I'm a WHAT!?I can't catch a break."]

This is also the best thread: check the bottom of page 2 to see a newbie.

You should have ran.

[MirAbsolutely nothing could go wrong.]

I have to say, letting it sink in a little more, this is probably one of my favorite episodes so far. It's just really well paced, the character interaction is spot on, there's plenty of well done humor, and it has that certain hearwarming aspect to it.
I found myself more aware of their facial expressions and body language too.
That look Sweetie Belle gets everytime she's about to "help".
Rarity's "I'm just about to lose it, but I can't scream at my little sister" faces.
The little stompy animation Apple Bloom and Sweetie do when they're squishing grapes.

I just had one of those "I can't believe I've having this sort of conversion about cartoon ponies" moments

I'm also wracking my brain trying to figure out what the egg part of the race was based off of. I know I've seen some sort of egg relay party game before, but I can't remember how it worked. A quick search suggests balancing an egg on a spoon, but I don't think that was it...

This is also the best thread: check the bottom of page 2 to see a newbie.

Aww... such an innocent little newbie.

[Headless Horse]

I saw it as a sort of cross between the egg-in-spoon race and the orange-under-chin relay (which seems to be not as widespread as I'd assumed): http://www.partydirectory.com/games/g043.htm

[londonarbuckleAND SOMEDAY YOU WILL BUCK LIKE I BUCK.]

This is also the best thread: check the bottom of page 2 to see a newbie.

I just remembered that my first post was in this thread too. Wassup, Sisterhooves buddy.

[Stuff]

Sweetie Belle: That's us!
Too cute. ahhhhhh

You should have ran.

I totally should have...

I just remembered that my first post was in this thread too. Wassup, Sisterhooves buddy.

hey what up awesome dude

[VaultAggie"Shawty, you the best"]

This episode rules and the twist completely took my by surprise. Like Headless said, the rewatch it even better because you get to appreciate that it's Rarity doing all these things.